Follower of Lolth through Malar, Heresy?

So I was hoping to play a little something out of the box, a druid of Malar. The character is from the Spine of the World, his clan had provided Menzo with slaves as well kept their local yath happy by making sure her dire spider was well fed. Upon the characters rite of passage the yath bid the spider's smallest runt to bite him. As he struggled to fight the poison that threatened to end his spark of life, the character had had visions of another path, through the deep wilds and the marauding beasts the ilithiri might tap some of their lost glory and rise up against their enemies. Through the lesser god Malar, who's long time ally to Lolth against the Seldarine, he could work magicks long forgotten by his people, magics that might surely give them an edge in the war.

Upon surviving the ritual the yath of his clan offered him blessing of the runt that'd bit him, it must be with Mala Lolths aid that he and the spider find their way through the deep wilds and answer the drums of war from the far away Dalelands. It is here he would find his destiny in the odd path she believed and it is there he would either bring fortune upon his mighty clan, or die trying.



With all that said, in our setting here, is there any way to make this work without being killed as a heretic. He is Lolthite, though obviously you cant be an evil druid of Lolth....What say you communities?

Please keep posts on topic. If you don't have something useful to say, then don't post.

In regards to the OP, I'll look at the books I have done tonight. I don't remember off top of my head about this topic.

But you don't think it would be possible to do Lolth's will through revering another. Of course not equally so, but obeying that god's tenants as well as Lolths? Subversion and intrigue are common in drow society, so using a lesser deity torwards Lolth's design might perhaps be accepted?

Well per FR wiki Malar has a standing alliance with Lolth against the Seldarine.. But there isn't much on it as well just stating the relationship between them. This also is on a god stand point, and not a mortals. Under "Relationships"

Just my modest opinion here, from what I have read. Not sure whether it's accurate or not, but while Lolth has allies in the other deities, including Malar, in Lolthian society Lolth is the only true deity. There are no lesser ones, greater ones, no other's but Lolth. She uses the other deities and their followers, but it seems to me that it would be extremely out of character for Lolth to admit that another deity, even an allied one, exists as a real God. As the passage above shows, the drow honor the other dark drow gods, but Lolth is a jealous deity, and punishes any who would worship one other than her.

Hence why I put at a god stand point. There is no way for mortals to know of it unless told by said gods that there is a alliance.. This by no means would make followers of these gods follow said alliance in anyway, in the drow case it would have to be a Lolth herself come to the material plane and tell all drow that follow her of this alliance and order them to follow it. This is the only way in my mind such a thing would be condoned. In short said character would be sacrificed or killed for heresy.

In addition, Lolth would never stay true to her words. Her intent would be to use Malar as a pawn against the Seldarine. She has done this before yet not against the Seldarine with Ghaunadaur but that backfired when she refused Ghaunadaur's romantic interests, this cause him to flee the demonweb in a destructive manner.

You say Clan. My question becomes is this guy a drow or what race is he.

Any drow worshipping another diety in a Lloth encampment would likely find himself on the alter regardles of Diety relations that does not always equate to partial relations among followers.

If he is non drow his acceptance in camp would be no better then that of a mercenary.

My initial thought is that you are seeking a way to associate a druid with the drow and I know that the staff has not been very receptive to that up to this point

The problem with NWN2 is its forced tie of druids to diety and while druids may follow the dogmatic teachings of certain nature gods thye do not draw their spells from these dieties rather they draw their powers from the forces of nature itself

This same issue hampers rangers and to an even greater degree spirit shamans

Well, I think it could potentially work. I know there are a few in the camp who have Selvetarm as their deity on their character sheet. It could be a similar scenario where you worship lolth, but revere another god as well. Since the only point of revering this god is so that you can better serve lolth I don't see much of a problem with it. If it is true that noone can serve lolth while having another deity, such as Selvetarm, on their character sheets, then the number of heretics in the camp has increased substantially.

Well part of that problem is FR lore. As far as i know according to FR lore druids/rangers get thier spells from a patron diety. And i have an issue with that because then what really makes a differance between clerics and druids? Druids are supposed to draw thier powers from nature, rangers as well. Spirit shamans are poorly potrayed in FR and expecially in NWN2.

But as far as a druid of Malar, i currently have a grey orc who follows malar because i cannot choose an orc diety as a spirit shaman.

If you want to play a renegade drow druid who follows malar then your pretty much going to be hated by EVERY faction except for the malarites. Lolthites will hate you for not bieng lolth, Moon dancers will hate you for following Malar, the druid circle will have you hunted down. Zhents will dislike you for bieng drow, MD will hate you for both bieng drow and following Malar. You might find a haven with the vhaerunites as well as the Malarites.

But as a suggestion there is always the possibility of playing an evil surface drow. But no matter what you do with the char chosen RP will be very difficult at times.

According to "Complete Divine" you can get your powers by devoting yourself to nature or even an abstract idea, it doesnt have to be a god.

In FR though, deities are required. Some of the other books are not world specific and they are generally the generic of the class across to the different worlds, specifically like Greyhawk setting.

In FR though, deities are required. Some of the other books are not world specific and they are generally the generic of the class across to the different worlds, specifically like Greyhawk setting.



Ah I gotcha. My bad

Zecretacc wrote:

Well, I think it could potentially work. I know there are a few in the camp who have Selvetarm as their deity on their character sheet. It could be a similar scenario where you worship lolth, but revere another god as well. Since the only point of revering this god is so that you can better serve lolth I don't see much of a problem with it. If it is true that noone can serve lolth while having another deity, such as Selvetarm, on their character sheets, then the number of heretics in the camp has increased substantially.

selvetarm is Lolth's warrior-slave so worshipping him is fine.

That very same book, Drow of the Underdark also has a section detailing the role of druids in Drow society and culture and it is possible to play one without being branded a heretic-particularly if playing a druid with affinity for spiders. I will try and find you the correct excerpts and post because the above excerpts are not taken in the context of the whole of the sourcebook.

DROW DRUID
Druids are rare among drow communities. Most drow spell-casters pursue either the faith of Lolth or one of a variety of arcane paths. However, a rare few exist who seek a different,
more natural connection between themselves and their
subterranean environment.
Drow druids forgo the ability to assume animal forms, preferring the shape of their revered totem: the spider. (pg 58 Drow of the Underdark)

But what religion are these drow? That is what is important.

No idea. I'be been looking through the books trying to find the passage that says something about Lolth and Druids, I know it exsists, I just can't find it :-)

I don't see a problem, as long as instead of worshipping the other god, you are merely using them to gain power. Wouldn't lloth approve of someone using another god to gain power while truly worshiping her. I see that as very chaotic.

afaik, only Shar and maybe Mask allow their followers to do that. Axe will know more though

Chaos does not override Lolth's mandates. One of them being that she is the only deity worthy of worship (or, in fact, the only one to exist). Selvetarm is the one sorta exception, but he's treated more like a saint than a full deity, and those whom worship him will also venerate Lolth (or pay the price!).

Is is one of the many things Lolth is very strict on.

Ok, but since Druids and rangers get their power from nature, wouldn't it be up to the DMs to say for instance, choose one of those gods but say you worship lloth, considering the game has limited perameters?

Nothing comes for free. If a druid or ranger is getting their power from nature, they must be devoted to it in some manner. If so, is that devotion compatible with Lolth's edicts? Besides which, I think in Faerun druids have to get their power from a diety. The nature thing applies to the Greyhawk setting. I think, someone correct me if I'm wrong.

I think Axe's point is that Lolth sees herself as the one true deity. Getting power from a demon aligned to her is one thing, but drawing power from nature means drawing power that does not come from her. It means concerning yourself with matters that will often be at odds with what Lolth desires.

Druids, remember, are about the care preservation of nature. I don't think Lolth care about that, at all.

I'm sure there are some Drow druids out there. Most anything is possible. I'd imagine them more as solitary heretics (I'm not going to venture to guess whom they'd worship, though) than a part of drow society. In truth, even druids up on the surface tend be outside of any defined society.